Aftermath of Israel's attack on Gaza flotilla - Peace for the Soul2024-03-29T08:30:30Zhttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?commentId=5143044%3AComment%3A27004&x=1&feed=yes&xn_auth=nowait a minute...peacefullover…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-28:5143044:Comment:270042010-06-28T05:44:04.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
wait a minute...peacefullover what are you doing by copying comments off another ning and stuff from Genevieve's blog? huh? That's kind of very weird. We are two separate people here by two separate invites from Eva. You dig? Now you had better disappear because you're freaky.
wait a minute...peacefullover what are you doing by copying comments off another ning and stuff from Genevieve's blog? huh? That's kind of very weird. We are two separate people here by two separate invites from Eva. You dig? Now you had better disappear because you're freaky. Yeah I LOVE the Jews against…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-28:5143044:Comment:270032010-06-28T05:23:38.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
Yeah I LOVE the Jews against Zionism! I wish I could attend their protests but of course I understand why they are doing what they are doing as an exclusive group. They are the people who know everything without waiting for actual events so I always read from them, they are honest, sincere, knowledgeable and a trustworthy source. Just love those guys! And I stand with them 100%.
Yeah I LOVE the Jews against Zionism! I wish I could attend their protests but of course I understand why they are doing what they are doing as an exclusive group. They are the people who know everything without waiting for actual events so I always read from them, they are honest, sincere, knowledgeable and a trustworthy source. Just love those guys! And I stand with them 100%. Hi peacefullover,
I said that…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-28:5143044:Comment:270022010-06-28T05:15:56.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
Hi peacefullover,<br />
I said that about John Lennon in a joking sense as I have no idea where he was going with that song. But I was reminded of the Bilderberg philosophy of one world government. Which is in fact their philosophy coming from a very powerful movers and shakers group. In particular I was reminded of Margarete Thatchers response when she had accepted an invitation to attend a Bilderberg meeting in which she was appalled. She apparently liked borders and she liked state sovereignty. As…
Hi peacefullover,<br />
I said that about John Lennon in a joking sense as I have no idea where he was going with that song. But I was reminded of the Bilderberg philosophy of one world government. Which is in fact their philosophy coming from a very powerful movers and shakers group. In particular I was reminded of Margarete Thatchers response when she had accepted an invitation to attend a Bilderberg meeting in which she was appalled. She apparently liked borders and she liked state sovereignty. As for John Lennon, I use to think he was referring to the 'afterlife' in that song because that's the only day anyone will see everything as One. In fact the song never made sense to me anyway. That's as much as I thought about it.<br />
That Ringo video....I have no idea what is a "Reptilian Eye", it gives no explanation. Oh darn I have to say one mor…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-18:5143044:Comment:227842010-06-18T19:28:30.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
Oh darn I have to say one more thing, just to explain my position and then I will stop. For real. If a thief came and stole my neighbors house and property, or an illegal government, I would take the side of the property owner. The excuses of the thief interest me <u>not at all</u>. I am the wife of a Palestinian and the daughter in law of 1948 nakba refugees. I have relatives who suffer as I speak in Nablus. There isn't much I don't know of the issue from both sides of the coin. I also have…
Oh darn I have to say one more thing, just to explain my position and then I will stop. For real. If a thief came and stole my neighbors house and property, or an illegal government, I would take the side of the property owner. The excuses of the thief interest me <u>not at all</u>. I am the wife of a Palestinian and the daughter in law of 1948 nakba refugees. I have relatives who suffer as I speak in Nablus. There isn't much I don't know of the issue from both sides of the coin. I also have land I have inherited from my in laws. I <i>intend</i> to recover it for my children. I intend to recover all of Palestine from the river to the sea. That is between God and me, and later between God and my children. Thanks to all who listened. I'm done for this thread.<br />
<br />
<cite>Hayyim Feldman said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?commentId=5143044%3AComment%3A22705&xg_source=msg_com_forum#5143044Comment22705"><div>Genie,<br/> <br/>
I don't want to get drawn into a clash of historical perspectives here in Eva's thread - especially not with someone who manages to cram so much factual error and hyperbole into one short paragraph, and does so with such supreme confidence. If you want to look into that history together, I invite you to initiate another discussion for that purpose on this site. Please let me know if you do so. The more welcoming you make it sound - the more your praiseworthy desire to speak your truth seems to be matched by your interest in listening and learning how other people see things differently from you - the more likely I am to engage in dialog with you about it.<br/>
<br/>
Meanwhile, to go back to where we began in this exchange, I'll just remind you that quite aside from any differences of perspective between us, there is neither any peace nor justice to be found in your repeated retreat from love into hostile polarization. Peace is as much about the quality of <i>relationship</i> among different kinds of people as it is about "correct" analysis, winning an argument, or politicians signing some diplomatic document.<br/>
<br/>
Blessings,<br/>
-Hayyim</div>
</blockquote> Guess we have to leave it her…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-18:5143044:Comment:227642010-06-18T18:07:29.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
Guess we have to leave it here then. I don't want to clog a thread, but I did not bring up the topic, it was already here and I responded.<br />
<br />
<cite>Hayyim Feldman said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?commentId=5143044%3AComment%3A22705&xg_source=msg_com_forum#5143044Comment22705"><div>Genie,<br></br> <br></br> I don't want to get drawn into a clash of historical perspectives here in Eva's thread - especially not with someone…</div>
</blockquote>
Guess we have to leave it here then. I don't want to clog a thread, but I did not bring up the topic, it was already here and I responded.<br />
<br />
<cite>Hayyim Feldman said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?commentId=5143044%3AComment%3A22705&xg_source=msg_com_forum#5143044Comment22705"><div>Genie,<br/> <br/>
I don't want to get drawn into a clash of historical perspectives here in Eva's thread - especially not with someone who manages to cram so much factual error and hyperbole into one short paragraph, and does so with such supreme confidence. If you want to look into that history together, I invite you to initiate another discussion for that purpose on this site. Please let me know if you do so. The more welcoming you make it sound - the more your praiseworthy desire to speak your truth seems to be matched by your interest in listening and learning how other people see things differently from you - the more likely I am to engage in dialog with you about it.<br/>
<br/>
Meanwhile, to go back to where we began in this exchange, I'll just remind you that quite aside from any differences of perspective between us, there is neither any peace nor justice to be found in your repeated retreat from love into hostile polarization. Peace is as much about the quality of <i>relationship</i> among different kinds of people as it is about "correct" analysis, winning an argument, or politicians signing some diplomatic document.<br/>
<br/>
Blessings,<br/>
-Hayyim</div>
</blockquote> Genie,
I don't want to get d…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-18:5143044:Comment:227052010-06-18T14:22:04.000ZHayyim Feldmanhttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/HayyimFeldman
Genie,<br />
<br />
I don't want to get drawn into a clash of historical perspectives here in Eva's thread - especially not with someone who manages to cram so much factual error and hyperbole into one short paragraph, and does so with such supreme confidence. If you want to look into that history together, I invite you to initiate another discussion for that purpose on this site. Please let me know if you do so. The more welcoming you make it sound - the more your praiseworthy desire to speak your truth…
Genie,<br />
<br />
I don't want to get drawn into a clash of historical perspectives here in Eva's thread - especially not with someone who manages to cram so much factual error and hyperbole into one short paragraph, and does so with such supreme confidence. If you want to look into that history together, I invite you to initiate another discussion for that purpose on this site. Please let me know if you do so. The more welcoming you make it sound - the more your praiseworthy desire to speak your truth seems to be matched by your interest in listening and learning how other people see things differently from you - the more likely I am to engage in dialog with you about it.<br />
<br />
Meanwhile, to go back to where we began in this exchange, I'll just remind you that quite aside from any differences of perspective between us, there is neither any peace nor justice to be found in your repeated retreat from love into hostile polarization. Peace is as much about the quality of <i>relationship</i> among different kinds of people as it is about "correct" analysis, winning an argument, or politicians signing some diplomatic document.<br />
<br />
Blessings,<br />
-Hayyim oh and about the non European…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-18:5143044:Comment:226032010-06-18T01:07:03.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
oh and about the non European or Arab Jews. The Europeans actually came to Palestine under their umbrella. Sneaky. When Palestine becomes a state for her people, we will not have to separate real Jews from fake Jews, foreign or otherwise. The people who love Palestine will continue to be the people of Palestine.<br />
<br />
<cite>Genie said:…</cite>
oh and about the non European or Arab Jews. The Europeans actually came to Palestine under their umbrella. Sneaky. When Palestine becomes a state for her people, we will not have to separate real Jews from fake Jews, foreign or otherwise. The people who love Palestine will continue to be the people of Palestine.<br />
<br />
<cite>Genie said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/comment/show?id=5143044%3AComment%3A22602&xn_out=json&firstPage=0&lastPage=1&_=1276822509148&xg_token=437f8d73ab81c2e1cd7569dabdd651bb#5143044Comment22602"><div>What I know is the Palestine Jews formed a consensus along with Palestine Muslims and Christians and they all opposed a Zionist State and also immigration of foreign Jews. They oppose it to this day. There are those who play ball because they have no choice but it has been in vain either way. As far as the enterprise being a thing of the past, I think we can look at what's left of Palestine today and what's left of the people and know the enterprise has been alive and well and moving full steam ahead since Rothschild and Balfour invented it. I simply see no dispute, it's there for those with eyes. Remember: Jews owned 6% of the land at the time the first Nakba. The rest is stolen. homes, farms, plantations, banks, cars, ports, railroads, schools, hospitals, trucks, tractors, etc. Agriculture, the Potash company, the airport. Water. Trade. All belong to Palestine. There was never going to be 2 states, another obvious thing when you look at the pattern of Israeli behavior. The reason you can't exclude the past and try and only view it as the "now" is because then you miss the pattern of behavior and events from the time of Rothschild/Balfour. There is a beginning of the plan, you can't just leave it out. They didn't just "quit" the plans or drop it or forget it with time! They have not missed a beat! They have never deviated, never "reconsidered." 62 years of genocide with no deviation. The "left" and the "right" has never deviated even if it seemed to at the time. The proof is in the pudding.<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
A<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
<cite>Hayyim Feldman said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?id=5143044%3ATopic%3A14719&page=2#5143044Comment22336"><div>Yes, zionism <i>began</i> in Europe, not as a European enterprise (much to Herzl's dismay) but as a European <i>Jewish</i> enterprise. But it has been a long century now that zionism as a movement has included Jews from well beyond Europe - and gotten mixed responses (support, opposition, indifference, etc.) from non-Jews in Europe and elsewhere. In any case it is hardly a European enterprise now.<br/> <br/> It is good to distinguish between zionism and Jews, but it is not an either/or distinction, like between species. It's more like distinguishing between green and soft: They don't <i>necessarily</i> go together, but it's quite possible to be both.<br/>
<br/>
Blessings,<br/>
-Hayyim</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</blockquote> What I know is the Palestine…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-18:5143044:Comment:226022010-06-18T00:55:16.000ZGeniehttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/BonnieLama
What I know is the Palestine Jews formed a consensus along with Palestine Muslims and Christians and they all opposed a Zionist State and also immigration of foreign Jews. They oppose it to this day. There are those who play ball because they have no choice but it has been in vain either way. As far as the enterprise being a thing of the past, I think we can look at what's left of Palestine today and what's left of the people and know the enterprise has been alive and well and moving full steam…
What I know is the Palestine Jews formed a consensus along with Palestine Muslims and Christians and they all opposed a Zionist State and also immigration of foreign Jews. They oppose it to this day. There are those who play ball because they have no choice but it has been in vain either way. As far as the enterprise being a thing of the past, I think we can look at what's left of Palestine today and what's left of the people and know the enterprise has been alive and well and moving full steam ahead since Rothschild and Balfour invented it. I simply see no dispute, it's there for those with eyes. Remember: Jews owned 6% of the land at the time the first Nakba. The rest is stolen. homes, farms, plantations, banks, cars, ports, railroads, schools, hospitals, trucks, tractors, etc. Agriculture, the Potash company, the airport. Water. Trade. All belong to Palestine. There was never going to be 2 states, another obvious thing when you look at the pattern of Israeli behavior. The reason you can't exclude the past and try and only view it as the "now" is because then you miss the pattern of behavior and events from the time of Rothschild/Balfour. There is a beginning of the plan, you can't just leave it out. They didn't just "quit" the plans or drop it or forget it with time! They have not missed a beat! They have never deviated, never "reconsidered." 62 years of genocide with no deviation. The "left" and the "right" has never deviated even if it seemed to at the time. The proof is in the pudding.<br />
<br />
<br />
A<br />
<br />
<br />
<cite>Hayyim Feldman said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?id=5143044%3ATopic%3A14719&page=2#5143044Comment22336"><div>Yes, zionism <i>began</i> in Europe, not as a European enterprise (much to Herzl's dismay) but as a European <i>Jewish</i> enterprise. But it has been a long century now that zionism as a movement has included Jews from well beyond Europe - and gotten mixed responses (support, opposition, indifference, etc.) from non-Jews in Europe and elsewhere. In any case it is hardly a European enterprise now.<br/> <br/>
It is good to distinguish between zionism and Jews, but it is not an either/or distinction, like between species. It's more like distinguishing between green and soft: They don't <i>necessarily</i> go together, but it's quite possible to be both.<br/>
<br/>
Blessings,<br/>
-Hayyim</div>
</blockquote> I didn't say anything about l…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-17:5143044:Comment:223862010-06-17T19:04:31.000ZHayyim Feldmanhttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/HayyimFeldman
I didn't say anything about loving zionism. (And I don't even know what it would mean to love a corporation, except in the sense that one might "love" ice cream.) But zionists, on the other hand, are indeed your precious sisters and brothers - just like the people who work at BP. Moreover, peace will not be made without a great many of them participating.<br />
<br />
Blessings,<br />
-Hayyim<br />
<br />
<cite>Genie said:…</cite>
I didn't say anything about loving zionism. (And I don't even know what it would mean to love a corporation, except in the sense that one might "love" ice cream.) But zionists, on the other hand, are indeed your precious sisters and brothers - just like the people who work at BP. Moreover, peace will not be made without a great many of them participating.<br />
<br />
Blessings,<br />
-Hayyim<br />
<br />
<cite>Genie said:</cite><blockquote cite="http://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/forum/topics/aftermath-of-israels-attack-on?commentId=5143044%3AComment%3A22317&xg_source=msg_com_forum#5143044Comment22318"><div>Zionism is a political ideology, love does not play into it. It's big business, like BP. I don't have to love BP.<br/></div>
</blockquote> Yes, zionism began in Europe,…tag:peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com,2010-06-17:5143044:Comment:223362010-06-17T18:53:26.000ZHayyim Feldmanhttps://peaceformeandtheworld.ning.com/profile/HayyimFeldman
Yes, zionism <i>began</i> in Europe, not as a European enterprise (much to Herzl's dismay) but as a European <i>Jewish</i> enterprise. But it has been a long century now that zionism as a movement has included Jews from well beyond Europe - and gotten mixed responses (support, opposition, indifference, etc.) from non-Jews in Europe and elsewhere. In any case it is hardly a European enterprise now.<br />
<br />
It is good to distinguish between zionism and Jews, but it is not an either/or distinction, like…
Yes, zionism <i>began</i> in Europe, not as a European enterprise (much to Herzl's dismay) but as a European <i>Jewish</i> enterprise. But it has been a long century now that zionism as a movement has included Jews from well beyond Europe - and gotten mixed responses (support, opposition, indifference, etc.) from non-Jews in Europe and elsewhere. In any case it is hardly a European enterprise now.<br />
<br />
It is good to distinguish between zionism and Jews, but it is not an either/or distinction, like between species. It's more like distinguishing between green and soft: They don't <i>necessarily</i> go together, but it's quite possible to be both.<br />
<br />
Blessings,<br />
-Hayyim